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warrensack
Warren Sack is a media theorist, software designer, and artist whose work explores theories and designs for online public space and public discussion. He is Professor and recently (until 2020) Chair of Film + Digital Media at the University of California, Santa Cruz where he teaches digital arts and digital studies. His artwork has been exhibited by SFMOMA (San Francisco), the Whitney Museum of American Art (New York), the New Museum of Contemporary Art (New York), the Walker Art Center (Minneapolis), and the ZKM (Karlsruhe, Germany). His scholarship and research has been supported by the Paris Institute for Advanced Study, the American Council of Learned Societies, the Sunlight Foundation, and the National Science Foundation. Warren received his PhD from the MIT Media Lab and was an undergraduate at Yale College. He recently published a book with MIT Press in the Software Studies series: The Software Arts.
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Comments
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@jshrager: As @peter.millican describes, it is possible to analyze a text using a variety of methodologies, some of which are more empirically driven than others. One could, of course, not grapple with intentions at all and, instead, for instance, …
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@nickm: Yes! Maybe we should pursue both intentional and symptomatic readings.
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@jshrager and @davidmberry: The materials you are finding in the MIT archives are incredible! I know this is supposed to be just a discussion thread, but you are opening what could be an entirely new long-lasting line of research on these topics wi…
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@peter.millican and @anthony_hay: Thank you for responding so thoroughly to my comments. I see, however, that my comments moved the conversation in a direction that I did not intend to pursue. @peter.millican, your textual analysis of Turing's pap…
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@markcmarino: Mark, your suggestion that we concentrate on the performance of gender rather than gender bias is inspiring. Thank you!
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@jshrager: No, I don't know about the Collins and Evans's work on the imitation game. I should have a look. Collins's work is important to me because he was one of the very few, until recently, from science and technology studies (STS) who paid an…
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@jshrager: I totally agree with you that Turing "thought that the man/woman game was interesting, not a covert way of injecting his gender identity into his science." Turing was not very covert about his sexuality; witness his arrest for homosexual…
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@anthony_hay: No, I do not think ELIZA/DOCTOR is an example of where women have been written out of history. ELIZA makes a clear reference to Shaw's Eliza Doolittle character and that reference clarifies what Weizenbaum was trying to do in specific…
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@jshrager: That's an interesting question: Did MADS have an interpreted mode? I'd imagine it did because of the history of (myth?) of the origins of Lisp: Steve Russell read John McCarthy's theoretical paper and realized that the Lisp eval function…
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@peter.millican: To the contrary! I am delighted to have my interpretation discussed and disputed! As I wrote, "Turing’s original proposal was, essentially, to build a machine to function as a man pretending to be a woman" and as you reply "there …
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@jshrager and @davidmberry: Wow! These are fantastic finds! An analysis of ELIZA beyond the DOCTOR script will be fascinating territory!
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“Chrestomathies,” like the site Rosetta Code, are resources for (programming) language learners which short passages (of code) or algorithms are translated into multiple languages. For example, the first ever programming language written was Ada Lo…
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@davidmberry : Regarding "iterability": Yes, I do diverge from Derrida and what I am trying to label here with the term is more the set of phenomena/working methods that @jshrager highlights in his last post on versioning systems and forking and his…
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@jshrager : Your discovery of the CHANGE function in the code is very exciting to me. The computer scientist, philosopher and historian, Tomas Petricek has a current of research in which he is looking at the history of programming environments as d…
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@ebuswell: Your comments on "lower" and "higher" level languages, translation, and Turing completeness are fascinating! I have some ideas about these issues too -- and a full explanation of what I mean by "translation" -- in my book, which is a lit…
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I'm watching a LASER talk by Amelia Winger-Bearskin right now. Very a propos of this thread. This might be a good resource: wampum.codes
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Thanks!
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Dear @nickm: I'd love to read the ELO presentation you did with Andrew Stern --"Provocation by Program: Imagining a Next-Revolution Eliza" -- but I can't get the link you provided to work. Maybe you could post it here?
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Also, in response to @davidmberry : I do agree that ELIZA/DOCTOR seems to anticipate bots in social media today but, again, I think we need to think about iterability. Are those bots really good translations of ELIZA/DOCTOR or are they not? I thin…
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@davidmberry : Thanks for correcting my oversimplifying of the Frankfurt School and my characterization of Weizenbaum et al. as anti-technologists. I was unclear how many on this thread would be familiar with the philosophical references Weizenbaum…
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@anthony_hay : You wrote, "I find the moralising in JW’s book Computer Power and Human Reason, e.g. about compulsive computer programmers, somewhat irritating. There are other parts of that book I didn’t agree with, but I don’t recall noticing any g…
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Another example: When Nick Montfort approached me about collaborating on 10 PRINT, I immediately rewrote the BASIC code in Perl and JavaScript to see what was most interesting about the BASIC code. It showed me that a certain hardware and character…
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@jshrager: My suggestion that we treat the script at the end of the 1966 article as source code was an attempt to get us to focus on the various ways that the script could be implemented. This suggestion was probably not necessary in this thread wh…
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@yaxu: Yes, I think it is a good question for ethnographers. I have worked with ethnographers on various projects, but am not an ethnographer. Ron Eglash's ethnographic work addresses this issue of writing down unwritten algorithms, but it would b…
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@jshrager 's site links to a set of ELIZA implementations here.
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A closely related question to @davidberry 's about the multiplicity of ELIZA's identity concerns what philosopher Jacques Derrida called "iterability": Does ELIZA remain ELIZA even in a new language, written by someone other than Weizenbaum, designe…
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@davidberry 's statement that "when we talk about ELIZA in future, perhaps we should be more aware of the multiplicity of its identity as a software object" resonates with me. Weizenbaum wrote a series of versions, but also inspired many others -…
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Moreover, it is also remarkable because it does situate itself culturally in a discourse about gender. I think the gender concerns are obvious in both Weizenbaum and Turing. I agree with what @p_yes_t posted above and maintain that a code review o…
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I mention this because if we dwell too long in the lower levels of the implementation we forget the remarkable context of Weizenbaum's work at the very beginnings of interactive and distributed computing. Here we have one of the first programs desi…
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The dependencies hypothesized by @davidmberry (Hi David!) are a series of "layered" languages from assembly to a domain-specific language developed specifically for the implementation of ELIZA scripts. I think this is one of the first examples of t…
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@nickm: This is fantastic to get to explore your book in this forum! Thanks for offering this to us! It sounds like you want to keep the focus on new programmers, but might we also have a thread for those of us who teach new programmers? I teach …
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@Zach_Mann: I think the master-slave metaphor was in circulation before the 19th c. Philosopher and mathematician Gottfried Leibniz (1646–1716) was also the designer of one of the first mechanical calculators and explained the division of labor lik…
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If we want to ground programming languages in craft, culture and heritage practices, we might look to helpful historical precedents. In my book The Software Arts I make the point that programming languages come from a long history of arts and craft…
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Dear CCSWG, I am Warren Sack, a professor of digital arts and digital studies at UC Santa Cruz. I am an artist, software designer and media theorist. My most recent publication is The Software Arts, MIT Press, 2019. I am a member of the editorial…